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tv   The Last Word  MSNBC  November 20, 2012 10:00pm-11:00pm PST

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>> i'm spectacular. i'm moved by the images of the president. but i'm going to hand it it over to you. >> thank you very much. thank you for sticking around for the the next hour. you might remember a period of time when the republican party was afraid of a guy named grover. it's not that time anymore. >> the gop post election fallout continues on a couple fronts. >> the fiscal cliff is getting shorter and shorter. >> voters agreed with me on this issue. >> more than congressional republicans. >> we don't understand. >> americans didn't vote for dysfunction. >> the voters agreed with me on this issue. >> they voted for government that works. >> we don't understand why raising tax rates is the solution. >> can party leaders get a deal? >> impossible.
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>> all this talk about taxing the rich is nonsense. >> grover norquist. >> you speak of grover norquist. >> he's an entertaining warrior. >> pledge mentality is really on the run right now. >> speaker boehner clearly wants a deal. >> he can't have one arm tied behind his back. >> the top 1%, only 42% of the wealth. >> 48.5 million people lived below the poverty level. >> we should ask the wealthy to start paying their fair share. >> the american sense of fairness, no one should pay more than 25%. >> today's republican party has imploded. >> they are in denial. >> they are looking for someone to blame. >> grover is no longer speaking for the party. >> they may not be willing to just die on this hill anymore. good evening. i'm ezra cline in for lawrence o'donnell.
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the craziest thing is happening in washington right now. you've probably heard of the fiscal cliff or as lawrence likes to call it, the fiscal curve or as my friend calls t the austerity bomb. whatever you would like to call it, it does not look like it's going to happen. it doesn't just look like we're going to avoid a crisis. at this moment today, and this can change, it looks like we're going to avoid an almost-crisis too. they might wrap it up and go home for christmas. almost everyone i have talked to has been weirdly confident and upbeat about where this is going. this shouldn't be an amazing thing for me to tell you. i shouldn't be coming to you saying, look, congress might not blow up the economy for no good reason. or if i do have to say it, i shouldn't sound excited about it. that should be a given.
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but in recent years, it has not been a given. and the reason it hasn't been is in some ways traceable to this guy. you know that guy. that is grover norquist. if you go by his name or his picture, he may not seem imposing. but in the republican party, he's a guy that breaks your knees if you vote for higher taxes. all republicans pretty much sign it and they are very, very, very loathed to break it. and that's made it impossible to reach a deficit reduction deal, until now. "the new york times" has an article in which republican after republican after republican goes on the record by name dismissing his pledge and his power. peter king says a pledge is good at the time you sign it. in 1941 i would have voted to declare war on japan. but each congress is a new congress and you can't have a rule that you're never going to raise or lower taxes.
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i don't want to rule anything out. senator of georgia said, i'm frankly not concerned about the norquist pledge. senator john mccain said fewer and fewer people are signing this "pledge." it's actually a pledge, but any way. senator coburn called it "a tortured vision of tax purity." and it did you want end there in that article. bill crystal said this. >> let's have a serious debate. don't scream and yell when one person says, it won't kill the country if we raise taxes on millionaires. i don't understand why republicans don't take obama's offer. >> a calmist at the national review wrote, as a matter of political strategy not to say survival, republicans will have to agree to raise taxes on those defined as rich. republicans must also contend with the pew poll that asked who
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would be more to blame if a deal were not reached. before a single meeting has been held, 29% said they blamed president obama while 53% said they would blame republicans in congress. former mississippi governor hailey barber was asked whether republicans should be open to upping tax rates if they got spending cuts in return. he said "if there's enough savings, if there's enough entitlement reform, if there's enough certainty about tax reform in the next few years, i would." i could keep going, but i'll leave it there. grover norquist says in the article, not to worry. "it's been 22 years since a republican voted for a tax
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increase in this town. this is not my first rodeo yes, it is. maybe it isn't. but the fact that you didn't fall off the bull at your rodeo doesn't mean you won't fall off at your 60th. but what isn't good news for grover may be. good news for the country. democrats are now and they have been for some time open to spending cuts. in fact, they already passed a trillion dollars of them into law in 2011. if republicans are willing to let the bush tax cuts for the rich expire as part of a larger framework, it's going to be not just a quiet christmas in washington, but a smooth one for the economy. i should say that we invited mr. norquist on the show e to explain why his pledge will hold, but he declined. so joining me now are two folks who have experience watching the pledge distort american politics and scotch many a deal. robert riech and now the president of the center for american progress, thank you both for joining me tonight. >> great to be with you. >> i want to begin with you, robert. does this feel different to you? pretty much the the first thing
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you guys did was propose a budget to reduce the deficit and it included a lot of tax increases and you didn't get one republican vote because of them. do you think republicans are cracking now? do you feel something different in the air? >> undoubtedly something different is in the air. it's called an election victory. but i will believe when i see it that republicans beginning to agree to a tax increase. grover norquist's pledge, the idea that somehow these republicans owe more of an allegiance to grover norquist than to the constitution or the american people, that is becoming difficult for a lot of republicans to sustain. the other point is that a lot of the power of that pledge came in the idea in every republican's head that every other republican was going to abide to that same pledge. if republicans are starting to say openly they are not going to abide and they are not going to
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continue to pledge to grover norquist, then there is a possibility that norquist may disappear. like the wicked witch of the west, that just melts away. that could be grover norquist. >> just throw water on the pledge, it just kind of melts. >> it may be melting before our eyes, but i'm just not sure yet. >> they say taxes -- there's more agreement there than people thought. it's becoming about what will be the spending side. what will republicans get to assure them they are going to get a deal that they like. what republicans seem to really want is what they would call reform or spending cuts on the medicare side. you guys, your think tank released a report on how to do that while protecting seniors. if the center for american progress is saying you can cut medicare, is there common ground
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that can be reached here? >> i hope so. in the distant past, it was republicaned talking about ways to strengthen medicare by ensuring we are lowering health care costs. $385 billion in additional savings in medicare, but importantly, our proposals protect middle income beneficiaries. the pledge has required that republicans really go after beneficiaries. both for medicare and social security. so we're saying you can have a good deficit reduction plan that has savings in medicare, but it's important that we protect those who are vulnerable in the middle class, seniors, those on medicaid and we can do that. and one thing i would say about the pledge, there's a lot of talk about the politics and republicans moving, et cetera. the issue here is not politics when we're together. americans support this idea of basic fairness. so when republicans break from the pledge, what they are doing
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is really just standing up with those people in those districts that support these ideas. and grover norquist makes a lot of noise about how for 20 years, republicans have stood with that pledge. but i would just remind him and others who support this pledge that republicans have not received a majority of the american public in five of the last six elections. so i think if the republican party wants to break out of the strangle hold, look like it's standing up for america, they will come to the table with the president. >> and one thing that i do think -- i don't know if norquist deserves credit, but i'm struck when i step back and look at where the tax debate is today. both democrats and republicans agree that we should keep 80% of the bush tax rates. bush tax cuts, i'm sorry. it's just the top percent that should change.
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even democrats today are closer to the bush consensus on taxes than to the clinton consensus on taxes. so do you think this conversation has moved to the right? or were the rates too high for this moment when the middle class is struggling. >> i wouldn't say that a consensus to reduce taxes on the middle class and increase taxes on the rich is a move to the right. it's actually a move to the left. what people are becoming more sensitive to is inequality of income and wealth and opportunity and power in this country is wider than it has been in about 85 to 100 years. therefore, it's appropriate and necessary to raise taxes on the rich and reduce the tax burden on the middle class and the poor. social security taxes are above what they were 20 years ago in terms of the proportion of their income that people pay on them. sales taxes are up. most americans are paying more in taxes than ever before. at the same time wealthy americans are paying less than ever before.
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this is an appropriate move. >> we'll be talking more about social security taxes and also goldman sachs. you'll enjoy that, robert. but neera, you know the hill better than anyone. will they get this done by the end of the year? or are there sticking points we're not seeing? >> this is the most optimistic i have ever been. and you know, that's not saying a lot sometimes because this whole debate around the budget has been like losing the football for awhile. but i actually think that you're seeing republicans moving in a way that they obviously didn't do, and you're seeing an understanding -- what i think is really important is there are a lot of people like bill crystal coming forward, governors are trying to make a play here. they represent whole states as
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well. so i think you're seeing a kind of break in this impass or fever that we haven't seen in the past. as you said, there's reasonable common ground to make in entitlements and medicare. we have done over a trillion dollars in domestic discretionary spending. if they come together on taxes, it's very doable. and i think that's a very important point for the american people. >> i don't want to rain on this lovely parade, but let me say one thing that worries me. democrats have an inherent love of compromise. republicans have shown themselves adverse to something called compromise. so even if grover norquist is not quite as powerful as he was before, even if the winds of change are drifting in our direction, let's not assume that democrats are automatically going to have the backbone they need.
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>> it's always washington. it can change. we'll have to leave it there. robert riech and neera tanden, thank you for joining me. coming up, what the twinkie and papa john's pizza have to do with the affordable care act. how chris christie is outsmarting the party. and what american workers ought to be doing and why he's wrong. constipation, diarrhea, gas, bloating? yeah. one phillips' colon health probiotic cap each day helps defend against these digestive issues with three strains of good bacteria. approved! [ phillips' lady ] live the regular life. phillips'. well, having a ton of locations doesn't hurt. and my daughter loves the santa. oh, ah sir. that is a customer. let's not tell mom. [ male announcer ] break from the holiday stress. fedex office.
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it is time to bid farewell to one of the most very, very, very crazy of a very crazy house republican majority. the last word tonight will belong to allen west. that's coming up. and the affordable care act claims to be unaffordable for some businesses. that's is next. a speed bump! [ wife ] a beached whale! lawn clippings!
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america is in mourning tonight. people have taken to blog and rebuild stories and photos of the twinkie. no disrespect to the others, but the twinkie is the prize product in the hostess cornucopia. the twinkie with its mix of vanilla and cake and weird shelf life, which is just about a month, not 25 years. that's a myth. twinkies which retail at 10 for $5 which have had their star turns on television. >> what do we have? hostess twinkies. yes, sir, i know the folks will surely love these. >> twinkies, which are made by hostess brands, which tonight announced that mediation talks with the bakers union have
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failed and it's filing for bankruptcy. you and i might look at that news and think, ohno, no more twinkies, but kroegman see es the end of a broader economic era. an era called the twinkie rare. a time when corporations did well and so did the people who worked for them. that was when family income doubled, which gave mom and dad more money to buy twinkies and televisions and cars. taxes were higher in that period both on the rich and corporations. and labor unions were much, much stronger. and yet in the twinkie era, corporations still managed to be profitable.
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the u.s. economy expanded more than at any other time in history. but something happened because corporations are still doing really, really, really well. but the people that work for them, not so much. corporate profits measured as a percentage have hit record highs. but compensation has hit record lows. look at this chart compared to profits and compensation over the last decade. profit profits is a percentage has surged to record levels. compensation, which workers get, has declined. and these are partially the same trend. corporations threaten to go overseas, they cut costs by give less and less to workers and keep more revenue as profit. in fact, it looked like a dragon. the dragon of inequality. so how do you slay the dragon of inequality and low worker compensation? the twinkie era is not coming back. and and here's what is coming. the affordable care act. explaining what it has to do requires moving from twinkies to pizza. and i recognize there's some irony in talking about junk
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food, but we're going to do it any way. papa john's has been complaining that the affordable care act might add 12 cents to the cost of their pies. that means it asks something of the company. if their workers end up needing to use public subsidies to afford health care, then papa john's needs to pitch in too or to the tune of about $2,000 per employee over the number of 30 or an eighth of the cost of the health care plan. that's not such a bad deal for papa john's. richard nixon's plan was 75%. bill clinton's plan was 80%. but it still gives papa john's
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reason to hate the act. but you know who it helps? businesses that have taken another approach to profit. the ones that have sought success by giving them reasonable benefits and delivering a higher-quality product. under the affordable care act, they take less in profits or they have to raise prices. either way, that means their competitors, the ones paying more for benefits and get a bit more of an advantage in the marketplace. the high road strategy becomes more profitable. and as for those workers, they are not going to be able to get health insurance either from their employer or from the government. that doesn't bring us back to the twinkie era or anything close, but it does, perhaps, mark the end of the papa john's era. joining me now is nick canour, it's good to see you.
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>> how are you? >> i'm good. i want to put up that dragon chart again. nick, as a venture capitalist, somebody who has been involved in growing companies, with you look at that, how do you understand the trends on that chart? >> you know, my view is that the papa john's complaint, the chart, the way in which our economy is structured to, you know, increase inequality in this crazy way represents a death spiral. when all of the money in a society is accumulated in the hands of a tiny minority of people, most people can no longer afford to buy the products from the companies. and the reason why our economy is in such tough shape, the reason the recovery has been so slow is we have created this crazy spiral of increasing
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inequality. and that's what's reflected in that chart. and you know, the papa john's complaint is the classic trickle down complaint and the trickle down idea takes two forms. if the rich get richer, the economy will be better off and also, it's never stated like this, but it's equally true, if the poor get richer, the economy will be worse off. and nothing could be farther from the truth. trickle down guys have been making this claim for generations. it was the claim when child labor laws were put into effect. basic safety rules were put into effect. when women started being paid fairly. frankly, slavery, the idea if we pay workers fairly, the whole world would come crashing down would prove not to be true. not only do we make people's lives better, but we animate a
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cycle of increasing returns for everyone. because the job creators is the purchasing power of the middle class. >> one thing on that cycle you're talking about, i think you see this in the economy and the kind of strategies we're talking about. when they lose the purchasing power, when i have trouble buying cars and going out to eat and things like that, you then get these retailers. some of then are dining, some are consumer goods, but they need to offer goods that are cheap enough for these consumers
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who are now more strapped to buy so they squeeze costs on their supply chain and their producers and paying their workers less and less. you try to lift the middle a little bit and they say you're destroying the business model. i'm quite sympathetic to what papa john's is saying, but at the same time, that at some point you need to break the cycle. an endless cycle in which you have retailers like walmart who are squeezing their employees in order to make goods cheap enough for folks to buy down the road, that doesn't get you prosperity. it doesn't build an economy more people can benefit from. >> not to get all wonky on you, but human social systems are complex and economic. they are by positive feedback loops that take two forms and only two forms. you either have virtuous cycles where things get better or death spirals where things get worse. races to the bottom. and this ridiculous idea if. we just keep squeezing workers at the bottom we'll get more prosperous is categorically
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untrue. if there was a shred of truth of any of these arguments, given how rich the rich have gotten, we would be drowning in jobs and prosperity. it's the opposite of true. the way you animate prosperity in a capitalist economy is by raising the bottom. and using the surpluses. >> nick, we'll have to leave it there. thank you for joining me tonight. and enjoy. coming up, new jersey governor chris christie isn't getting any love from his own party. and later, one person we shouldn't be listening to when it comes to when workers should be able to retire. the ceo of goldman sachs. i'll explain why. into their work,
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today is a big day. we finally know who will represent florida's 18th congressional district. it will not be allen west. what made him finally concede and what it means for the tea party in the house is coming up. and republicans, you might remember this. they used to love chris christie. now they are really, really mad at him and somehow -- that topic is next. want to try to crack it? yeah, that's the way to do it! now we need a little bit more... [ male announcer ] at humana, we understand the value of quality time and personal attention. which is why we are proud
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even reschedule her package. it's ups my choice. are you happy? i'm happy. i'm happy. i'm happy. i'm happy. i'm happy. happy. happy. happy. happy. (together) happy. i love logistics. in the spotlight tonight, governor chris christie is outsmarting the republican party. "the new york times" reveals today that republicans are mad at chris christie for embracing president obama during the hurricane sandy relief effort. fox news chief rupert murdoch spoke to him before the election. he was blunt. "mr. christie looked like a spoiler." republicans who attended the annual meeting last week were mad at christie too.
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i will not apologize for doing my job, christie told one of them in a hotel hallway. and republican donors, you guessed it, also mad at christie. a top romney aid described him as furious. but chris christie knows exactly what he is doing. does the name george allen ring a bell? once upon a time and not all that long ago, he was going to be president. virginia's george allen. he was the son of a hall of fame nfl coach and after serving as class president at the university of virginia, allen served in the virginia house of delegates as a congressman, as a governor and as united states senator. in december of 2005 shs the senator prepared for his reelection race, the insiders poll asked 100 republican politicians and consultants, who had the best chance of winning the party's nomination in 2008?
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the insiders picked allen as number one. number one. at the time they said of the former football player, allen knows the perils of looking upfield and it will raise eyebrows. george allen did not have an impressive win. he did not win at all. he lost because he said some kind of dumb, kind of racist things. but he also lost because virginia became democratic. in '04 bush won by 8 points. in 2008, president obama won by 6. now no one talks about george allen for president because it turns out that's what's really bad for your prospects is losing your own reelection campaign. and that brings us back to
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governor christie. the republican party loved governor christie. after watching him slash spending and humiliate employees on youtube, they begged him to enter the race. he gave the keynote at the republican national convention. the only problem for his rise to the presidential nomination is that he is the governor of a very blue state. much more son than virginia and his reelection in 2014 is not by any means a sure thing. as of october, his approval rating was 56%, but in a head to head matchup for the governorship, christie polls at 46% and the mayor of newark cory booker polls at 42%. if christie wants to be president of the united states, he can't pull a george allen and lose his race for reelection. he has to win a state that just voted for president obama by a 17-point margin. here is what chris christie knows.
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before he gets republicans to love him, he needs a lot of voters in new jersey to love him even more. if his recent embrace of obama didn't win him friends, it is winning him friends in the northeast. according to a poll released on tuesday. new york city voters gave christie higher marks than mayor bloomberg for handling the storm. a full 89% approved of his performance. if christie can get reelected with big numbers and popular enough to put blue states like new jersey in play, then the republican party, which is terrified by. its inability to speak to voters beyond its base, they will be begging christie to run. begging.
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if he wins, and he wins big, they are not going to be mad of the him for long. joining me now is msnbc's joy reid. how are you? >> i'm doing well. >> so much as i think they will one day come to forgive chris christie, watch how his recent visit to "saturday night live" played with eric bowles. >> let's look at the republican acting like a democrat governor chris christie slobbering a wet kiss on president obama's cheek with days until the election. then this curious appearance on "saturday night live" while jersey still suffers from power outages and massive job losses. >> slobbering wet kiss. do you think i'm underestimating this? >> i think it will take longer to heal. your theory is sound as far as getting relelkted in new jersey. he did the right thing when it comes to remaining governor of new jersey. but i think that the idea that he can be forgiven enough by the base to run for president in 2016 presumes that republicans
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are going to basically do a punch the base strategy. because look, the part of the party that's about winning elections, the sort of wing that's the political wing, definitely is going to look to chris christie as a good candidate because he's a guy in a blue state. however, they have to contend with the joe the plumber part of the base who despises chris christie and the fact that he pulled a charlie crist. so that presumes that the hack wing of the party can compel the joe the plumber wing of the party to accept yet another northeastern blue state governor as their nominee. >> but here's the thing. one of my rules in republican presidential politics and it doesn't hold for congressional campaigns, but the hack wing always wins. in 2000, george bush got in. he was popular to some degree, but he was the son of a quite
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unpopular former president. in 2008 they give it to john mccain, the guy who spit in their face for four years. then in 2012 they give it to mitt romney, the guy who did romney care, the predecessor to obama care. so what i have been thinking about christie, he's a bit ahead of the curve in trying to step past mitt romney. the other guy trying this strategy is bobby jindal. he's just been hammering romney. i point out christie's reaction to jindal's comments on "morning joe." >> you're seen as a leader. it was a terrible thing to say and said terribly? >> yeah, sure. you can't expect to be the leader of all the people and be devisive. you have to talk about themes,
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policies that unite people. >> i feel like we're seeing two camps emerge here. mario rubio trying to say we need a better candidate. you're seeing the jindal/christie theory of 2016 where they try to move beyond the base a bit or seem like they are moving beyond the base to talk to new voters. do you think that's about right? >> i think you can add jeb bush to that camp as well. my head is spinning from chris christie, mr. punch a teacher saying we have to be less divisive. but he's very divisive in union issues. that wing of the party understand they are going to do to have base expansion. in order for them to get the nomination, they are going to do what john mccain and mitt romney had to do. during the primary, they are going to have to go hard right. because the evangelicals are still there and the tea party wing is still there and they are mad at chris christie. >> joy reid, thank you for joining me tonight. >> thank you.
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coming up, goldman sachs ceo says the answer to our economic woes is you just need to work longer. that's ahead. and what the end of elmo's career in the house means for the rest of the tea party. that's coming up. [ male announcer ] it's that time of year again.
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and register your purchase online. have a super sparkly day! ok. [ male announcer ] now all you need is a magic carriage. citi price rewind. buy now. save later. is the ceo of goldman sachs really the guy you want to listen to about raising the retirement age? my take on the solution that everyone needs to work longer, that's coming up. and later we bid farewell to florida's tea party favorite allen west. he finally, finally conceded and cable news will never be the same. superior drivers? yeah. yeah. then how'd i get this... [ voice of dennis ] safe driving bonus check? what is that? so weird, right? my agent, tom, said... [ voice of dennis ] ...only allstate sends you a bonus check for every six months you're accident-free... ...but i'm a woman. maybe it's a misprint. does it look like a misprint?
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look, if you're the ceo of goldman sachs, if you have a fun job that you love, that you can build a scrooge room where you swim through a pile of gold, a job that makes you so much money that only the tiniest fraction of it is taxed to keep social security solvent, then you really shouldn't be saying this. >> look at the history of these things. social security wasn't devised to be a system that supported you for a 30-year retirement after a 25-year career. so there will be certain things that the the retirement age has
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to be changed. maybe some of the the inflation adjustments have to be resolved. but they have to be contained. >> that's the ceo of goldman sachs and he's not saying anything that people with desk jobs don't say all the time in washington and in new york. but it's got to stop. if you want to talk about cutting social security, just talk about cutting it. it's a reasonable point of view. you're allowed to say it. what makes me disgusted, though, is the cavalierness with which people who get paid a lot of money and who love their jobs, people you'll have to take out of the office on a stretcher when they are 90, the cavalierness they talk about raising the retirement age. social security wasn't designed for all these old people who live a long time. and to some degree, who cares? the country's economy has grown
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15 fold and one of the things we can buy with that money is a decent retirement for people who don't have jobs they love and who don't want to work forever. that's a gift of a rich society. moreover, this idea we have gained over years, it's not true or not nearly as true for poor folks who rely on social security. as you can see on this graph since 1977 the life expecty of male workers retiring at 65 has risen a full six years if they are in the top half of the income distribution. if they are not, it's only risen 1.3 years. so if you're wealthy, you have many, many years to enjoy social security. but if you're not, you don't. so making it so people who aren't wealthy have to wait longer to use social security is a cruel way to cut the program it's not just a cut, it's a cut that's particularly tough on people who spend their lives in
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jobs that don't enjoy. you know what age people begin taking social security? 65 is what most people think, but they are wrong. if you wait until age 70, you get bigger benefits, but no one does that. most people begin taking social security at age 62. that is as early as the law allows you to take benefits. when you do that, you get smaller benefits over your lifetime. we penalize you for taking your benefits early. but most people do it any way and they do it because they don't want to spend their whole lives at that job. unlike many folks, they don't want to work until they drop. and that's what galls me about this easy argument. the pundits and the senators and ceos they will never feel it. they don't want to retire at age 67 or 70, but you know what they would feel and don't advocate, social security taxes don't apply over $110,000 a year. the total compensation was $16.1
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million. that means he paid social security taxes on less than 1% of his compensation. if we lifted that cap, if we made all income all the way up to $16 million subject to payroll taxes and they estimate it would do three times as much to serve the shortfall. in fact, that one move would all at once assure the program's solvency for the next 75 years. i don't need to pick on him here. he's one of the ceos that agree his taxes need go up. but the folks that talk about raising the social security retirement age as if it's a no brainer, they need to think harder about why they have settled on the single cut to social security that will concentrate its pain on people
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who are poor, who haven't fully shared in increase in life expectancy and who don't like going to their jobs every day. why are they the people who should sacrifice the most on social security. great. where's your gift? uh... whew. [ male announcer ] break from the holiday stress. ship fedex express by december 22nd for christmas delivery.
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it that means i'm the number one target for the democrat party, all i got to say is one thing. bring it on, baby. >> it's been broughten. today allen west conceded defeat. >> i went back and tried to do an analysis of some of the recount data that we did get and we did not think we would be able to get that .08%. so we're not going to continue on to challenge this or contest it. >> thus ends at least for now the storied political career of mr. west.
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but before he goes, a salute that has done more for cable news than any other living politician. except maybe for sarah palin. we'll never be able to pay him back fully, but hopefully this salute to some of his greatest hits will clear the size of our debt. >> you must be well informed and well armed because this government that we have right now is a radical government. >> i cannot change my color. people can change their sexual behavior. and i have seen people do that. i like chocolate chip ice cream. and i will continue to like chocolate chip ice cream. there's no word about me changing to vanilla. >> give me that damn gavel.
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>> radical islamic terrorism and they are here in our country. there are 36 training camps. there's one in northern florida. there's two in my home state of georgia. for those of you that take your summer vacations in new york, upstate of new york there's a place there. >> take your message of equality of achievement, take your message of economic dependency, take your message of enslaving the entrepreneurial spirit somewhere else. you can take it to europe, you can take it to the bottom of the sea, you can take it to the north pole, but the hell out of the united states of america. >> joining me now on this sad day is msnbc contributor dave weigel. it was an amazing race. i thought west was a part of a particular kind of politics. he spent more money than any
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losing house candidate in history. outspent murphy by $14 million. what went wrong? >> this is more than michele bachmann who ran for president. he didn't spend it that wisely. west was combative. we could show more video. he has an inspiring story. he grew up pretty poor. his family served military. he was contrite about why he did so, but he ran this campaign against patrick murphy. he said he was a stand in. he had no real opponent. and they tried to demean him the way he demeaned everyone else who was his opponent in politics. it didn't play to that level of disrespect for your opponents at every level.
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>> what a funny thing. but you bring up michele bachmann. democrats speak several of those members. michele bachmann who was a reasonable presidential candidate, almost lost joe walsh, actually did lose. do you think they are going to rethink that or just sort of a function of the unique circumstances of 2012? >> it's almost new. josh mandel, who was another rising star, lost to sherrod brown, two years ago they wouldn't have thought he was going to lose. and same complaint there. he raised a lot of money. $40 million in outside spending. he attacked him constantly. it failed there. who was advising him? there was just a sort of fog of advice around all republicans the more intense you could be, the more palin-like, you could win. >> dave weigel, thank you.


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